Q. What was your movie-going experience as a child?
A
The first movie I ever saw in a theatre was Joshila. I used to be bad in Hindi and my mother (Lateef Fatima) told me if I got 10/10 in the subject, she would take me to watch a film. I scored full marks and I remember we went to Vivek cinema hall to watch it. I later came to know that it was directed by Yash Chopra and produced by Gulshan Rai. So, my connection with Yash Chopra goes back to that time. My mom was a movie lover. Those were the days of the VCR. We used to watch movies on the VCR on a black and white TV. We didn’t have a colour TV. There was this guy called Vinit, he later acted in two movies, he used to sell VCRs in Chandni Chowk, I became friends with him for the love of movies. My mother suffered from pain in her legs. So every night, my sister (Lala Rukh) and I used to press her legs and watch movies. That was a ritual. We used to watch all kinds of films. Biswajeet was my mother’s favourite hero. She thought he looked handsome. She loved Dilip Kumar and thought I looked like him. Every time a new movie released, mom, sister and me would watch it at Uphar theatre. After my father’s death (Taj Mohammed Khan), watching films was ‘our’ thing. I fondly remember watching Himmatwala (1983). I used to go on cycle and buy the tickets. It was a cool thing to do.
Q. Did you think then you’d be in the movies some day?
A
I never wanted to be an actor; I always wanted to be a sportsman. The first person who thought I could be an actor was Harry Baweja. He called my mother and told her, “Main aapke bete ko zaroor hero banaoonga.” My mom immediately wrote his number on a wall. Mom, of course, wanted me to be in the movies. I was 17-18 then and I used to do theatre. One day, Lucky Ali’s brother shot me on a video camera and told me I was photogenic. I didn’t want to do movies. But once my mother died, there was nothing left in Delhi. So I packed my bags and came here. I am in the movies because of my mother. When Harry met me in Bombay, he asked me why I hadn’t called him on the number he had given to mom. That’s why, he and his son, Harman (Baweja), will always be special to me. I came to Bombay thinking I’d do television. I started working with Aziz Mirza (Circus). There were also Saeed Mirza, Ashutosh Gowariker, Neeraj Vora, Makrand Deshpande, Kundan Shah. It was a nice set up. I got money and continued working in Bombay.
Q. Has the way you watch movies changed now than the way you did in childhood?
A
Not really. I loved all movies then. I love all movies even now. I can’t judge a film. Some movies may have got bad reviews but I thought they were fantastic. I find it wrong to judge a film. I believe I’m the worst person to show a film to. When actors-actresses ask me how I liked the film, they’re shocked when I tell them I liked it. They’re like how could you like that film Shah. And I’m like, but I loved the film. I find beauty in everything. I feel films should not be cut. (Laughs) Though when I look bad in my films, I ask to them to cut it. For me, the most beautiful thing in my childhood was pressing my mom’s legs and watching a movie. Those days, you could rent a film for ` 10 but you had to return the cassette the next day. The cassettewallah would come knocking on your door. Because there were other people waiting in line to watch the film, there was a madness and an urgency to watch it. That has changed now. Today, we hardly hear someone saying, “Man! I have to see that film anyhow.” I also feel some purity has gone from watching films. Maybe, too much analysis and personal criticism is to be blamed for it. I like watching films with my children. They see films with the purest eyes.
Q. Which are the movies that had the most impact on you?
A
Padosan (1968) and Jaane Bhi Do Yaaro (1983). I loved these two movies. I thought they were hilarious. Padosan had a certain innocence about it. I showed my kids Jaane Bhi Do Yaaro recently. We settled down with popcorn and I told them how funny the movie was. And I hoped they’d like it. Sadly, they didn’t find it funny at all. As a kid, I thought it was the funniest film ever. But times have changed. They couldn’t understand the relevance of the film. Sholay (1975) was another film that had an impact. I don’t remember how many times I’ve watched it. My father loved Madhubala. So I watched a lot of her movies too. They were attractive but I won’t swear by them. I watched all Amitabh Bachchan movies. I was so disappointed by one of the interviews in your magazine when he was asked about Nastik and he said if you want me to enjoy my lunch, don’t talk about it. I was disappointed that he spoke like that about Nastik (1983) because I loved that film. I can imagine how he must have said it in his baritone, ‘Don’t talk about it’. Another film close to my heart is Chalti Ka Naam Gaadi (1958). I loved the songs. Then the heroes also had a great impact on me. I knew Amitabh Bachchan and Rishi Kapoor ruffled their hair after combing. I also started doing that. Whenever I film a romantic song, I can only think of Rajesh Khanna. He’s my inspiration for that. I liked all Biswajeet movies because of my mother. I recently met him and told him how my mom was a huge fan of his. My mom liked Joy Mukherjee too, so even I liked his films. Dilip Kumar was her favourite though.
Q. How influenced were you by Dilip Kumar?
A
Actually, I knew Dilip saab as a kid. Dad knew him. They used to live in the same galli in Delhi. I’ve met Dilip saab many times in my childhood. We have been to his place often. Actually, Sairaji doesn’t remember this but her medicines used to be sent by my aunt from London. Years later, when I was working with Ketan Mehta, I saw a picture of Dilip Kumar in his office and I was like oh! that’s me. He looked so much like me in that picture. Or rather I looked so much like him. But my relationship with Dilip saab goes beyond films. Dilip saab and Sairaji have always thought of me as their son.
Q. Tell us about your experience about working with Amitabh Bachchan in Mohabbatein?
A
Mohabbatein (2000) was Amitji’s comeback film. So I felt he was a little unsure about himself. It happens with all actors. On the set, Adi, (Aditya Chopra), Karan (Johar) and I were all his fans. I remember doing one scene with him where he says, ‘Tum kya samjhatey ho Raj Aryan! Yahaan pe aakey tum pyaar…’ and I thought this is not how Amitabh Bachchan should be doing it. He should do it differently. I was looking at him as an audience, as a fanboy… not as a co-actor. Because I was so excited to work with him and without realising my place, I went up to him and told him if he could do it another way. He listened to me and tried it my way. Ultimately, of course, he did it in his way and it was the best way. But he gave me an ear, he didn’t dismiss me. That’s what a good actor would do. He’ll take in your thoughts and not just put across his. Mr Bachchan delivers what the audience wants to see and not what he wants to show. There is lot of humility in him as an actor. He would take time out to talk to young actors on the set. That was sweet. The media perceives him as a reserved guy but on set he’s the most interesting and fun person to be with. He has interesting conversations with you. I’ve had really good times with him. He’s great at scrabble, we’ve played couple of times. He beats everyone in it. His knowledge is amazing. If you ask him who the President of Uganda was in 1972, he’ll give you the answer. He makes me want to read more and gain more knowledge.
Q. Who were your favourite actresses?
A
My all-time favourite actress is Mumtaz. I found her saucy and extremely beautiful. I liked Saira Banu too. She looked so innocent on screen. She looked so beautiful in Bhai batur (Padosan) and in the Kashmir ki kali hoon main (Junglee, 1961) song. Also, that towel song, Thoda sa thehro, in Victoria No 203 (1972). She was amazing.
Q. Do you think our cinema stands up to the international level?
A
We shouldn’t dumb down our cinema. We should maintain our culture. Song and dance is part of our culture. That’s the USP of our films. That’s the reason we have movie stars in this country. You don’t have the star system anywhere in the world apart from Hollywood. We have it because of the culture of our cinema. And that culture is thanks to Mughal-e-Azam, Pakeezah or any Aamir Khan film or for that matter Sholay and Shaan too. They are entertaining films. There’s action, drama, dance… everything. Yet it’s not unintelligent cinema. So we should not sell our souls to pseudo intelligence. Some of our recent films are just trying to seem intelligent. There’s no storytelling. My great grandmother could tell better stories than them. Why are we trying to lose our culture? We need Guru Dutt back. Pyaasa was artistic and brilliantly told. That’s the big issue of 100 years of cinema. We are apologetic about liking a Hindi film. This is not right. We speak about Hollywood films in a different manner… ‘What a great film Silver Lining Playbook is!’, ‘How amazing is Spider-Man’, ‘The Die Hard series is so bloody good.’ Why can’t we say such things with the same confidence about our good films? We need to take a cue from the West. Films mean serious business to them. They have immense respect for comebacks. Drug-addicts, who have reformed, are welcomed. Gerard Butler was an alcoholic. But look where he’s now. Here, he would have been looked down upon. If people from the industry start taking films seriously, the audience will too.
Q. So you think our actors are not taking films seriously?
A
You know for most of them it’s like, ‘Arrey aisi filmein aaj kal chal rahi hai, toh yeh kar lete hai.” Their attitude is, ‘Picture banate hai, paise kamaate hai aur apni zindagi mein khush rehte hai.” I don’t get it why filmmakers don’t think about the audience anymore. In this 100 years of cinema celebration, we should get the focus back on the audience. You can’t dumb the audience down by saying yeh film toh single screen mein hi chalegi. You can’t divide the industry. Yes, businesswise it’s okay but not in terms of creativity.
Q. Do you think the corporatisation of films is responsible for that?
A
The enigma of cinema is gone because of the focus on business. As soon as you attach numbers to a film, you limit it. Films are meant to be an escape from reality. It’s something to take your mind away from everything that you do everyday. This is what you do everyday – Baajra kitne ka aaya? Oh 100 rupaye ka! Kitne ka ghar liya? And now we’re doing the same with films. How much did the film make? We are only calculating… We’ll make a 40 crore film, we’ll get so much from satellite rights, so much from theatre revenue and this will be the final profit on the table.
Q. But wouldn’t you also think like that as a producer?
A
I think like a producer for three nights after my film flops. But otherwise, I don’t. That’s why I believe I’ll not last in the industry for long. Unless I have people working for me who think only business.
Q. Earlier films were tagged with 100 weeks, silver jubilees, etc. So figures were put to films that time also…
A
There’s a difference. Hundred weeks spoke about the longevity of the film. It talked about how much people liked the film.
Q. At the recently concluded FICCI Frames, a corporate giant said that the 100 crore reality will soon become a 1000 crore dream. Because of this phenomenon hasn’t our industry become bigger?
A
The corporate guy is right about what he said. That’s his work. He can tell me to make a 1000 crore film. But he should not tell me how to make that 1000 crore film. He shouldn’t tell me you have to finish the film in 40 days, you have to add an item number. He should think about marketing of the film and leave the creativity to me. I’m the content-maker. He has to trust me as a content-maker and I’ll trust him back.
Q. Do you think more of mind has come to our movies and the heart has taken a backseat?
A
The two things are not demarcated properly. And therein lies the problem. Like a financer and seller are also making films and creative people are also marketing the films. I believe the jobs should be left to experts. You should be able to differentiate between the two aspects. A creative person should not think about business and the business guy should not think about the creative aspects. Right now, everything is over-lapping. But I believe with time it will get sorted.
Q. But you have conquered both the areas – creativity and marketing.
A
It was the saddest moment of my life when they termed my passion for films as marketing. I absolutely hate it when people call me a marketing genius. Why don’t they understand that I’m just a passionate filmmaker who wants the whole world to see his film? Sadly, my love for cinema is looked on as canny marketing.
A
The first movie I ever saw in a theatre was Joshila. I used to be bad in Hindi and my mother (Lateef Fatima) told me if I got 10/10 in the subject, she would take me to watch a film. I scored full marks and I remember we went to Vivek cinema hall to watch it. I later came to know that it was directed by Yash Chopra and produced by Gulshan Rai. So, my connection with Yash Chopra goes back to that time. My mom was a movie lover. Those were the days of the VCR. We used to watch movies on the VCR on a black and white TV. We didn’t have a colour TV. There was this guy called Vinit, he later acted in two movies, he used to sell VCRs in Chandni Chowk, I became friends with him for the love of movies. My mother suffered from pain in her legs. So every night, my sister (Lala Rukh) and I used to press her legs and watch movies. That was a ritual. We used to watch all kinds of films. Biswajeet was my mother’s favourite hero. She thought he looked handsome. She loved Dilip Kumar and thought I looked like him. Every time a new movie released, mom, sister and me would watch it at Uphar theatre. After my father’s death (Taj Mohammed Khan), watching films was ‘our’ thing. I fondly remember watching Himmatwala (1983). I used to go on cycle and buy the tickets. It was a cool thing to do.
Q. Did you think then you’d be in the movies some day?
A
I never wanted to be an actor; I always wanted to be a sportsman. The first person who thought I could be an actor was Harry Baweja. He called my mother and told her, “Main aapke bete ko zaroor hero banaoonga.” My mom immediately wrote his number on a wall. Mom, of course, wanted me to be in the movies. I was 17-18 then and I used to do theatre. One day, Lucky Ali’s brother shot me on a video camera and told me I was photogenic. I didn’t want to do movies. But once my mother died, there was nothing left in Delhi. So I packed my bags and came here. I am in the movies because of my mother. When Harry met me in Bombay, he asked me why I hadn’t called him on the number he had given to mom. That’s why, he and his son, Harman (Baweja), will always be special to me. I came to Bombay thinking I’d do television. I started working with Aziz Mirza (Circus). There were also Saeed Mirza, Ashutosh Gowariker, Neeraj Vora, Makrand Deshpande, Kundan Shah. It was a nice set up. I got money and continued working in Bombay.
Q. Has the way you watch movies changed now than the way you did in childhood?
A
Not really. I loved all movies then. I love all movies even now. I can’t judge a film. Some movies may have got bad reviews but I thought they were fantastic. I find it wrong to judge a film. I believe I’m the worst person to show a film to. When actors-actresses ask me how I liked the film, they’re shocked when I tell them I liked it. They’re like how could you like that film Shah. And I’m like, but I loved the film. I find beauty in everything. I feel films should not be cut. (Laughs) Though when I look bad in my films, I ask to them to cut it. For me, the most beautiful thing in my childhood was pressing my mom’s legs and watching a movie. Those days, you could rent a film for ` 10 but you had to return the cassette the next day. The cassettewallah would come knocking on your door. Because there were other people waiting in line to watch the film, there was a madness and an urgency to watch it. That has changed now. Today, we hardly hear someone saying, “Man! I have to see that film anyhow.” I also feel some purity has gone from watching films. Maybe, too much analysis and personal criticism is to be blamed for it. I like watching films with my children. They see films with the purest eyes.
Q. Which are the movies that had the most impact on you?
A
Padosan (1968) and Jaane Bhi Do Yaaro (1983). I loved these two movies. I thought they were hilarious. Padosan had a certain innocence about it. I showed my kids Jaane Bhi Do Yaaro recently. We settled down with popcorn and I told them how funny the movie was. And I hoped they’d like it. Sadly, they didn’t find it funny at all. As a kid, I thought it was the funniest film ever. But times have changed. They couldn’t understand the relevance of the film. Sholay (1975) was another film that had an impact. I don’t remember how many times I’ve watched it. My father loved Madhubala. So I watched a lot of her movies too. They were attractive but I won’t swear by them. I watched all Amitabh Bachchan movies. I was so disappointed by one of the interviews in your magazine when he was asked about Nastik and he said if you want me to enjoy my lunch, don’t talk about it. I was disappointed that he spoke like that about Nastik (1983) because I loved that film. I can imagine how he must have said it in his baritone, ‘Don’t talk about it’. Another film close to my heart is Chalti Ka Naam Gaadi (1958). I loved the songs. Then the heroes also had a great impact on me. I knew Amitabh Bachchan and Rishi Kapoor ruffled their hair after combing. I also started doing that. Whenever I film a romantic song, I can only think of Rajesh Khanna. He’s my inspiration for that. I liked all Biswajeet movies because of my mother. I recently met him and told him how my mom was a huge fan of his. My mom liked Joy Mukherjee too, so even I liked his films. Dilip Kumar was her favourite though.
Q. How influenced were you by Dilip Kumar?
A
Actually, I knew Dilip saab as a kid. Dad knew him. They used to live in the same galli in Delhi. I’ve met Dilip saab many times in my childhood. We have been to his place often. Actually, Sairaji doesn’t remember this but her medicines used to be sent by my aunt from London. Years later, when I was working with Ketan Mehta, I saw a picture of Dilip Kumar in his office and I was like oh! that’s me. He looked so much like me in that picture. Or rather I looked so much like him. But my relationship with Dilip saab goes beyond films. Dilip saab and Sairaji have always thought of me as their son.
Q. Tell us about your experience about working with Amitabh Bachchan in Mohabbatein?
A
Mohabbatein (2000) was Amitji’s comeback film. So I felt he was a little unsure about himself. It happens with all actors. On the set, Adi, (Aditya Chopra), Karan (Johar) and I were all his fans. I remember doing one scene with him where he says, ‘Tum kya samjhatey ho Raj Aryan! Yahaan pe aakey tum pyaar…’ and I thought this is not how Amitabh Bachchan should be doing it. He should do it differently. I was looking at him as an audience, as a fanboy… not as a co-actor. Because I was so excited to work with him and without realising my place, I went up to him and told him if he could do it another way. He listened to me and tried it my way. Ultimately, of course, he did it in his way and it was the best way. But he gave me an ear, he didn’t dismiss me. That’s what a good actor would do. He’ll take in your thoughts and not just put across his. Mr Bachchan delivers what the audience wants to see and not what he wants to show. There is lot of humility in him as an actor. He would take time out to talk to young actors on the set. That was sweet. The media perceives him as a reserved guy but on set he’s the most interesting and fun person to be with. He has interesting conversations with you. I’ve had really good times with him. He’s great at scrabble, we’ve played couple of times. He beats everyone in it. His knowledge is amazing. If you ask him who the President of Uganda was in 1972, he’ll give you the answer. He makes me want to read more and gain more knowledge.
Q. Who were your favourite actresses?
A
My all-time favourite actress is Mumtaz. I found her saucy and extremely beautiful. I liked Saira Banu too. She looked so innocent on screen. She looked so beautiful in Bhai batur (Padosan) and in the Kashmir ki kali hoon main (Junglee, 1961) song. Also, that towel song, Thoda sa thehro, in Victoria No 203 (1972). She was amazing.
Q. Do you think our cinema stands up to the international level?
A
We shouldn’t dumb down our cinema. We should maintain our culture. Song and dance is part of our culture. That’s the USP of our films. That’s the reason we have movie stars in this country. You don’t have the star system anywhere in the world apart from Hollywood. We have it because of the culture of our cinema. And that culture is thanks to Mughal-e-Azam, Pakeezah or any Aamir Khan film or for that matter Sholay and Shaan too. They are entertaining films. There’s action, drama, dance… everything. Yet it’s not unintelligent cinema. So we should not sell our souls to pseudo intelligence. Some of our recent films are just trying to seem intelligent. There’s no storytelling. My great grandmother could tell better stories than them. Why are we trying to lose our culture? We need Guru Dutt back. Pyaasa was artistic and brilliantly told. That’s the big issue of 100 years of cinema. We are apologetic about liking a Hindi film. This is not right. We speak about Hollywood films in a different manner… ‘What a great film Silver Lining Playbook is!’, ‘How amazing is Spider-Man’, ‘The Die Hard series is so bloody good.’ Why can’t we say such things with the same confidence about our good films? We need to take a cue from the West. Films mean serious business to them. They have immense respect for comebacks. Drug-addicts, who have reformed, are welcomed. Gerard Butler was an alcoholic. But look where he’s now. Here, he would have been looked down upon. If people from the industry start taking films seriously, the audience will too.
Q. So you think our actors are not taking films seriously?
A
You know for most of them it’s like, ‘Arrey aisi filmein aaj kal chal rahi hai, toh yeh kar lete hai.” Their attitude is, ‘Picture banate hai, paise kamaate hai aur apni zindagi mein khush rehte hai.” I don’t get it why filmmakers don’t think about the audience anymore. In this 100 years of cinema celebration, we should get the focus back on the audience. You can’t dumb the audience down by saying yeh film toh single screen mein hi chalegi. You can’t divide the industry. Yes, businesswise it’s okay but not in terms of creativity.
Q. Do you think the corporatisation of films is responsible for that?
A
The enigma of cinema is gone because of the focus on business. As soon as you attach numbers to a film, you limit it. Films are meant to be an escape from reality. It’s something to take your mind away from everything that you do everyday. This is what you do everyday – Baajra kitne ka aaya? Oh 100 rupaye ka! Kitne ka ghar liya? And now we’re doing the same with films. How much did the film make? We are only calculating… We’ll make a 40 crore film, we’ll get so much from satellite rights, so much from theatre revenue and this will be the final profit on the table.
Q. But wouldn’t you also think like that as a producer?
A
I think like a producer for three nights after my film flops. But otherwise, I don’t. That’s why I believe I’ll not last in the industry for long. Unless I have people working for me who think only business.
Q. Earlier films were tagged with 100 weeks, silver jubilees, etc. So figures were put to films that time also…
A
There’s a difference. Hundred weeks spoke about the longevity of the film. It talked about how much people liked the film.
Q. At the recently concluded FICCI Frames, a corporate giant said that the 100 crore reality will soon become a 1000 crore dream. Because of this phenomenon hasn’t our industry become bigger?
A
The corporate guy is right about what he said. That’s his work. He can tell me to make a 1000 crore film. But he should not tell me how to make that 1000 crore film. He shouldn’t tell me you have to finish the film in 40 days, you have to add an item number. He should think about marketing of the film and leave the creativity to me. I’m the content-maker. He has to trust me as a content-maker and I’ll trust him back.
Q. Do you think more of mind has come to our movies and the heart has taken a backseat?
A
The two things are not demarcated properly. And therein lies the problem. Like a financer and seller are also making films and creative people are also marketing the films. I believe the jobs should be left to experts. You should be able to differentiate between the two aspects. A creative person should not think about business and the business guy should not think about the creative aspects. Right now, everything is over-lapping. But I believe with time it will get sorted.
Q. But you have conquered both the areas – creativity and marketing.
A
It was the saddest moment of my life when they termed my passion for films as marketing. I absolutely hate it when people call me a marketing genius. Why don’t they understand that I’m just a passionate filmmaker who wants the whole world to see his film? Sadly, my love for cinema is looked on as canny marketing.
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